Dragon Quest VI, anybody?

[Mogri]

And I see no point in trying to beat the game at a incredibly low level because if you did/could, it would:

a) not be as enjoyable because it is clearly easy, or
b) be for an odd reason you must have inside of you.

This is just completely incorrect.

[Voltire]

Or, my opinion.

[Spoonweaver]

tsk tsk Voltire:

I disagree with grinding not being fun. The countless battles you fight build up to the joy you feel when you find your team can finally beat that pesky boss.
If grinding wasn't fun WoW would be out of business. As would the whole MMORPG business.
Thinking back to my first grinding experience, Phantasy Star 4, I remember grinding for hours in that game and having fun the whole time doing it. Beating those crazy hard bosses was so awesome to finally do that it justified all the hard work I did.

As for beating a game at as low a level as one can, it's sort of a challenge. It's like getting an achievement in a game. Just because this one isn't recorded doesn't really make it less justified. I mean alot of the ones that get recorded are pretty silly. Coming up with fun ways to challenge yourself at an old game keeps a game that you've beaten a dozen times interesting.

[Voltire]

I did not say grinding wasn't fun. I said that it can or cannot be fun, depending on if the battles are fun.

It does feel rewarding to finally defeat a challanging boss, but not if it was a huge bore getting to that point.

I guess beating a game at a low level can be a personal challenge you want to conquer, but not for me.

[mjohnson092088]

I guess beating a game at a low level can be a personal challenge you want to conquer, but not for me.

if i really like a game, i'll beat it every which way possible. all items, no items, max level, minimum level, all skills, no skills, every class, minimum classes, etc. but, only if i really like a game, like FF5 or Kingdom Hearts (which i wish i still had my PS2 for).

I did not say grinding wasn't fun. I said that it can or cannot be fun, depending on if the battles are fun.

ugh... so many bad games... so many bad memories... so many wasted hours. why? why?! WHY?! why did i have to play Magna Carta?! that game was fun at first, but it got old fairly quickly. and the battles started to feel like they were just dragging on and on. a game is no fun if you have to stop and heal your party every other turn, and if the battles are too boring to make you want to grind, then you might as well use that game as a $40-$60 paperweight.

[JSH357]

Whoah, whoah. My point was that grinding is unnecessary. I didn't say anything about whether or not it was entertaining, which is an entirely different subject. There's no reason to grind in a Dragon Quest game, not even for money. You pick up enough armor in dungeons to make up for any you didn't upgrade in towns, and generally you'll have enough money to get the best weapons and cheap armor upgrades if you spend wisely.

Now, I can understand leveling up a bit at the very start of one of the games. But people seem to think you have to do this consistently, which is not the case. Dragon Quest is about sub-quests and dungeon exploration, not grinding for levels; you gain the levels you need from pushing the narrative forward. If you want a grind heavy game, Etrian Odyssey is a much better example: it's impossible to finish an EO game without leveling up.

Newbie Power was reacting to an argument we've had in the past that has nothing to do with what I said here.

[mjohnson092088]

Now, I can understand leveling up a bit at the very start of one of the games. But people seem to think you have to do this consistently, which is not the case. Dragon Quest is about sub-quests and dungeon exploration, not grinding for levels; you gain the levels you need from pushing the narrative forward.

yeah, this is what i meant. moreso for money and basic equipment rather than leveling (you'd be surprised how much damage is reduced after you get yourself a shield and decent armor in the beginning, at least in DQVI).

some people grind, some people prefer not to, whether out of neccesity or just for fun. let's get back on topic.

i just got the mirror of ra. i know where to go from there, but... i don't know why i'm doing it. the crappily translated ROM doesn't have any text explaining ANYTHING after the fourth character joins, soo... what the heck is going on? someone want to give me a spoiler and explain it to me, so it doesn't ruin anyone elses game who might be looking at this thread?

[mjohnson092088]

GAH i tried to patch my ROM file with a more complete version, and now it's unplayable. i didn't make a backup either. i guess the patch and ROM weren't compatible. maybe that's a sign that i should stop playing that game all day long and get back to work on my game...

[Voltire]

Ah, well, at least buying the game from a reliable store means you won't have errors whe you play (by this I mean I hope Best buy doesn't sell you a bootleg game).

I joined the army and am searching for a way under the river that the gnome told me about.

[mjohnson092088]

Ah, well, at least buying the game from a reliable store means you won't have errors whe you play (by this I mean I hope Best buy doesn't sell you a bootleg game).

I joined the army and am searching for a way under the river that the gnome told me about.

ah yes, it's not hard to find. you have to actually use "search" though, you can't just walk around the area and hope you land on the right tile.

[msw188]

JSH understands things JSH understands things

I'm really glad someone else made the point that the DQs are NOT about grinding, but about exploring and fighting battles as you do so. That, and spending and saving intelligently. Interestingly, this might mean that DQ games can actually be 'harder' with a strategy guide - knowing exactly where to go and what paths to take in dungeons will almost certainly force some grinding at some point.

That said, I have to admit that I needed to do some extra grinding in DQ2, beyond the beginning of the game. I think that's the closest to consistent grind-necessity I've seen in DQ (I did not play 1 until much, much later, and I honestly already forget it). I remember having to do some grinding in 6, but I also abused save states, reducing actual recorded exploration. That experience really taught me how important the DQ system of saving is to the balance of those games.

[JSH357]

JSH understands things JSH understands things

I'm really glad someone else made the point that the DQs are NOT about grinding, but about exploring and fighting battles as you do so. That, and spending and saving intelligently. Interestingly, this might mean that DQ games can actually be 'harder' with a strategy guide - knowing exactly where to go and what paths to take in dungeons will almost certainly force some grinding at some point.

That said, I have to admit that I needed to do some extra grinding in DQ2, beyond the beginning of the game. I think that's the closest to consistent grind-necessity I've seen in DQ (I did not play 1 until much, much later, and I honestly already forget it). I remember having to do some grinding in 6, but I also abused save states, reducing actual recorded exploration. That experience really taught me how important the DQ system of saving is to the balance of those games.

As I said in my first post, the first 2 (maybe even 3; never finished DQ3) DQ games are a whole different ball of wax.

[Mogri]

The original Dragon Warrior is almost entirely about grinding and nothing else. If you are obsessive, it is also about seeing what kind of fun you can have with Gwaelin.

[msw188]

JSH: Just went back and reread that first post, sorry about that man! I remember thinking you had said "since the first DQ", not sure why.

Mogri: Haha, that's pretty funny. DQ games are the best.

[mjohnson092088]

haha, awesome. i never noticed the things with gwaelin. i think i just warped back to the castle as soon as i found her. wish i tried some of that stuff.