P O L I T I C S (Beware! Debates may lurk within!)

Talk about things that are not making games here. But you should also make games!

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camdog
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Post by camdog »

James Paige wrote:What won me over to Obama was listening to him talk. He is all over youtube.

The first time I ever heard of him was after his speech at the 2004 democratic national convention. I had not actually watched any of the coverage myself, but I was talking politics to my Mom on the phone, and she is like "We need to get this Obama guy to run for president!" and I'm like "O-who?"
Yeah, Obama is a great speaker, no doubt. I just don't understand why people (not saying you, necessarily) who love Obama are so cold about Clinton. I can't think of any issues they substantively differ on. I think I would prefer Obama to Clinton all things considered, but this is mostly for relatively minor things, like how she and Bill's politicking lately has been kind of nasty lately, or some of her weird recent votes in the senate, like voting for a bill classifying the Iranian Revolutionary Guard as a terrorist group (not to mention the fact that a presidential line of succession that reads Bush - Clinton - Bush - Clinton weirds me out a little bit.)

Still, if she wins the primary, I imagine I'll vote for her, unless perhaps if she ends up running against Paul.

[edit]

To The Drizzle:

I've been reading your post and trying to think of a good response to your question, but I have to admit I'm a little confused by your choice of candidates. You say McCain and Obama are honest and genuine, and I agree, they are and I admire them both for that. However, otherwise they seem nearly polar opposite to me. What about the issues? What issues do you care most about?
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Mogri
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Post by Mogri »

McCain and Obama are the most moderate candidates in the election.
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camdog
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Post by camdog »

In what way is McCain so moderate? Except for in a few things, such as campaign finance reform and immigration issues, McCain is very conservative, especially in the 'major' issues this election cycle, such as the war, iraq, and the economy. In terms of the war, he is probably the most hawkish candidate running right now. This is all a stark contrast to Obama, which is why I was wondering why his choice boiled down to those two.
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Bob the Hamster
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Post by Bob the Hamster »

camdog wrote:In what way is McCain so moderate? Except for in a few things, such as campaign finance reform and immigration issues, McCain is very conservative, especially in the 'major' issues this election cycle, such as the war, iraq, and the economy. In terms of the war, he is probably the most hawkish candidate running right now. This is all a stark contrast to Obama, which is why I was wondering why his choice boiled down to those two.
McCain only looks moderate when held up in comparison to Romney, Huckabee, Guliani, etc. (Paul excluded of course, he is more Libertarian than he is anything else)
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Uncommon
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Post by Uncommon »

I wanted Kucinich, but if we're being realistic, and if I were even registered (don't a state ID so they won't let me) I'd vote for Obama. Everything I've read about him gives me a lot of respect for him, and Hilary's got twenty years of being one of the country's worst censors under her belt. If it came between Hilary and Romney, I might consider adding two hundred more miles to the move to Seattle I'm planning on taking this summer.

And honestly, I'm pretty burnt out on Ron Paul.
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Mogri
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Post by Mogri »

Wait, you're moving to Seattle? We can totally hang out.
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Uncommon
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Post by Uncommon »

It seems a much better place to open a record store than Savannah, and it's been almost half my life since I lived there, so yeah.
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Only One In All
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Post by Only One In All »

Does Obama really have a chance with that middle name of his? I'm not saying I wouldn't vote for him because of that, I'm just saying a lot of other people might not.

EDIT: Anyone notice that our general discussion posts went from games to things more world related events all of a sudden?
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Bob the Hamster
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Post by Bob the Hamster »

Lonely Rolling Star wrote:Does Obama really have a chance with that middle name of his? I'm not saying I wouldn't vote for him because of that, I'm just saying a lot of other people might not.
Sad but true. There are still people out there who make fun of hist first name's resemblance to "Osama". But I have never heard anybody of the non-drunken-redneck variety make a big deal out of his name.
Lonely Rolling Star wrote:EDIT: Anyone notice that our general discussion posts went from games to things more world related events all of a sudden?
....Prompting me to open <a href="http://slimesalad.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1974">this thread</a>
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the drizzle
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Post by the drizzle »

In what way is McCain so moderate? Except for in a few things, such as campaign finance reform and immigration issues, McCain is very conservative, especially in the 'major' issues this election cycle, such as the war, iraq, and the economy. In terms of the war, he is probably the most hawkish candidate running right now. This is all a stark contrast to Obama, which is why I was wondering why his choice boiled down to those two.
In terms of the war, sure they are very different. But that's hardly my number one issue. A major thing I want to see in my lifetime is a decrease in the bureaucracy of the federal government that prevents things from ever actually getting done. McCain has a record of attempting to do things along these lines and Obama definitely talks the talk and I believe him.

Regarding major issues...

Abortion... no president will ever do anything major to change this and that's probably for the best. I don't know why the media turns this into a semi-major issue every election year. It detracts from what actually needs to be talked about.

Economy... I'm definitely into the whole "decreased government spending" thing. So I like the tax cuts that McCain extended (but didn't originally support) and in general, I like conservative economic policy (conservative in economic terms, not in political terms). But some limitations need to be set up immediately with regard to the sub-prime mortgage sector.

Taxes... Obama gets the edge. I like his ideas for making major changes to the tax code compared to other candidates call for the Fair Tax. The Fair Tax doesn't seem realistic to me. Too easily exploitable.

Immigration... McCain and Obama have similar ideas here but differ in their execution. Increased border security is a good thing, of course, but to what extent? Ultimately, I think there's still too much uncertainty regarding what will work and what won't. But I like allowing a path to citizenship for some current illegal immigrants, which both support.

Health-care... I like many of the specific plans laid out by McCain (malpractice reform #1, among others) and some of the more general plans laid out by Obama (federal insurance option, among others). McCain's seems a lot more realistic in the short term, like making major changes to the system rather than a huge overhaul.

The War in Iraq... I've stated my opinions on this already, but to reiterate, I'm with McCain on this one. I'm not sure the reasons for us being there are the best, but we're there now. And all the democrats who talk big about pulling out early I think are going to find out that the logistics behind this are more difficult than they realize. There's definitely more involved in this than what can be seen on the surface. So whoever gets voted in, I think we'll be there for a while.

EDIT: Oh, I forgot to mention one issue I actually do care about... Social Security. It needs to be fixed. Obama as far as I know, has no plan to change this. I like the idea of actually using the money as planned instead of using it as just another way to allow more outrageous government spending, so I'm pro-allowing-people-to-use-some-of-their-tax-money-to-put-into-retirement-funds. If that's a word.

So as you can see, it's not a black and white type of thing. There are things I like and things I don't like, as is possible when you don't blindly follow what your party says like a sheep (not that any of you are, I'm only saying).

One of my favorite polls I've seen in recent history that shows the stupidity of party loyalty went down like this. The pollster describes a bill as Bush-backed or Clinton-backed. "How do you feel about the Bush-backed plan to eliminate blah blah blah?" In the case of republicans, 90% agreed and 10% disagreed. In the case of democrats, 10% agreed and 90% disagreed. Can you guess what happened when they changed the question to "How do you feel about the Clinton-backed plan to eliminate blah blah blah?" Exactly the opposite. 10% agreement by republicans and 90% agreement by democrats. This is what's wrong with politics today.

My point is, just because McCain and Obama might seem different in some ways, a lot of their similarities are ignored because of the minutia of perceived party differences. Not that they're exactly the same but they're not all that different. I see major change in the future if either of them get elected.
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Machu
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Post by Machu »

I'm voting Ron Paul, and that's says pretty much all you gotta know about my politics.
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Uncommon
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Post by Uncommon »

the drizzle wrote:But I like allowing a path to citizenship for some current illegal immigrants, which both support.
Ultimately, that is one of the big things as far as I'm concerned. America is a country full of immigrants, after all, not even the Native Americans were really indigenous to it. So all these people who are up on getting tough with immigrants really need to glance back a few generations and remember where they came from.

I mean, whatever happened to "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"?
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Bob the Hamster
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Post by Bob the Hamster »

Machu wrote:I'm voting Ron Paul, and that's says pretty much all you gotta know about my politics.
I have some Libertarian sympathies too.
Do you have a second choice, assuming that he is not likely to get the numbers he needs?
Rock & Roll Sentai wrote:I mean, whatever happened to "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"?
Amen to that!
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Nathan Karr
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Post by Nathan Karr »

What we need to do is increase the number of people who can legally immigrate, then hire a bunch of those new people to patrol the border. Heck, I'm for removing the numerical quota altogether.
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the drizzle
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Post by the drizzle »

Ultimately, that is one of the big things as far as I'm concerned. America is a country full of immigrants, after all, not even the Native Americans were really indigenous to it. So all these people who are up on getting tough with immigrants really need to glance back a few generations and remember where they came from.

I mean, whatever happened to "Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free"?
I 100% agree. I don't think it's immoral to break the law in this country to look for a better life for themselves and their families. I really don't like the idea of villainizing people who are just trying to improve there lives and aren't really hurting anyone in the process. That's what America is all about.

My philosophy is, let's make it a little easier for people who are serious about becoming citizens and contributing to our economy/political system, and harder for people who are looking to get in for the wrong reasons. Not to mention, the government stands to benefit in many ways by this, for example, by the tax revenues brought in by illegal immigrants who are currently not paying.
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