What am I looking for now?

On the contrary, I think it's better to start scripting as soon as possible so that you grasp the concept of how to use it at the same speed as you would in learning how to develop maps and NPCs. That way you can never be uncomfortable with trying to plot your ideas. You also gain a better understanding of what the engine can and cannot do when you dive into plotscripting early. Honestly, I'm sure you know how to draw. That's all "learning the engine" really is about (unless you're making battles, which requires some mathematics--ick). Jump into scripting; it's the part that lets your creativity shine, not just come alive.

You can use Hamster Whisper to script if you want a built-in dictionary, or Notepad if you want to keep it simple. Just remember, always open your document with these commands:



"Mygame" is whatever the name of your RPG file is. I don't know if it's still required, but it helps if you name your main plotscript file the same as your RPG file. "mygame.txt," for example. That way you can keep track of which file belongs to which game.

Everything after the included files belongs to the scripting itself, including global variables (which store numeric values permanently, or until you change them), and plotscripts (where the magic happens).

A plotscript can be as simple as walking an NPC down a path:



Then import the script, decide how you want to trigger it (autorun, NPC activation, etc.), and set the script to the trigger. And that's it. Simple.

If you want to keep track of what your scripts or certain parts of your scripts do, use the # symbol at the front of the line and then write in whatever you want.

Another piece of advice: Have one blank NPC walkabout set available to use for your invisible triggers. It's a good idea to make it early so that it can retain a low picture number. This is perfect for step on NPCs that trigger an event, or tiled objects that the hero can "look at."

Also, setting your palettes to "default" is much easier than tracking down palette numbers later. And, if you ever need to script a palette change for any reason, "-1" is the number for "default." It may be a long time before you'll need to know that, though.

But yeah, don't wait to dive into plotscripting. Holding back will make you soft to it later. There's a reason why two-year-olds learn a foreign language faster than twenty-year-olds do. Write your first plotscript tonight.

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I agree with Pepsi in one sense. The sooner you start messing with plotscripts (simple ones, at least), the better.

I disagree on 'drawing' being all there is to learning custom, though. If you just want to tell a story with graphics, then yes that is the meat of it. But if you plan on making a game with obstacles that the player must overcome, then drawing is less than half of the learning process.

If the obstacles are anything but battles, scripting is probably necessary right away, as well as a healthy understanding of the map editor (especially using NPCs on the map for various things, not just text boxes).

If the obstacles are going to include battles though, there's plenty more to get familiar with. The attack editor alone is a pretty massive project; I doubt very many people here make use of all of its features. If your game is going to feature many battles, I suggest you start messing with attack chains right away. And the numbers start coming into play as well. Hero stats, enemy stats, how they relate to the damage and aiming formulae, and how they can be boosted by equipment (item editor for this), having multiple heroes with various attacks and spells...

Can you tell us anything about the game you are planning on making? We can probably tell you fairly quickly what aspects of the game are easy or hard (or impossible - not very much, but there are some things that are still impossible in the OHR) to accomplish, and how to start working on them.

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I am Srime

Can't argue with that. It's an incredible feeling to see your own cutscenes play out before your eyes - it's the main reason why I've decided to continue working with RPGs.
I guess I'm being bogged down by the idea that plotscripts are difficult and tedious. Make no mistake, scripting is tedious, and it's awful having to slug through hours of bug-fixing - an inevitable and necessary chore. But once you've practiced enough, it's not difficult at all, since all you're doing is re-using basic commands to do more and more interesting things.

Unless you're considering making a platformer, that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish.

My usual scheme when learning a new engine has been to create a test game where I attempt to use as many of the engine's feature as possible within the first one or two maps without bothering with story. I'm thinking my next dive will be into the Attacks editor and creating a few varied battles then I'll jump into plotscripting.

Right now I'm working on making an RPG in a futuristic setting. The first map I've created is what I intend to be an opening cutscene with a character walking through a corridor, accessing a wall computer to open a door then the player assumes control over the character as they explore a lab facility.



I'd like there to be more obstacles than just battles. I'm guessing you can use NPCs and Tags for locked doors requiring keys, huh? I'd like to have conversations during some combats too and perhaps some mini-games that could be played on certain computers within the game.

At the moment I'm not sure what I really want to accomplish with this game but I plan on writing out a design document soon and that's when I'll start testing the limitations of the software.

Here's a couple questions:

Is it is feasible to have say five or six characters in a party but only allow three in combat but allow the player to swap between all but the main character?

How difficult is it to create on-screen effects like weather, explosions, fire ect.

I have a door with three red lights above it. How could animate it so the lights blink?

How difficult is it to create multi-choose dialogue branches within text? Ex:

NPC: "How are you today?"

PC:
{"I'm fine."}
{"I'm having a terrible day!"}
{Say Nothing}



What about creating a scene with a jet or airship flying through the sky? Is there a way to display larger images on screen?


That's all I can think of right now.

Ah, I also meant to mention that when messing with the Layers on a map it frequently crashes. I just lost about 15m worth of map making cause of this. I know! I know! I should keep backups but seriously, it'd only been 15m and yet I lost several map tiles I'd just created! Arrrg!

Anyone else have a problem with crashes during editing of Layers? Also, I'm using Windows 7 and wondering if there were any compatibility issues with that.

What version are you using?

Hi, welcome. You've probably realised this by now, but though these forums in theory are not engine specific, in practice everyone here is an OHRRPGCE user and this is one of the main community sites. Hence NeoSpade jumping the gun with a bewildering reply like that. I'm afraid I can't say much about alternative engines, though there's a page on the wiki about them.



There are no known issues with Windows 7. No one has reported a crash in the map editor in the last year. Could you please provide as many details as possible, so I can track this down? What version are you using (I assume the latest stable, Ypsiliform+3)? If you can remember, what exactly were you doing -- are you saying the crashes all occurred in the Layers & Tilesets menu? -- and what had you just done immediately before the crash? Just added a layer or changed layer? Also, there's a good chance that any crash is due to game corruption (not that that is common). Could you also save a extra backup copy of game somewhere? It's awfully annoying when people say "the engine was crashing constantly yesterday, so I overwrote my game with a backup copy and now it's fixed". So please, report every bug you find.

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Realise that when people say little is impossible, that they mean that it is so if you are prepared to script your whole game nearly from scratch in what is an extremely primitive scripting language (although these crazy people deny this!) -- though there is a large library of commands. This engine is for top-down 20x20-tile-based Final Fantasy-like RPGs running at 320x200 in 256 colours, and annoying limitations abound, though we are always working on making it more flexible.

I'm sorry for the bad quality of the Using Map Layers HOWTO chapter. I stuck it in-between the other chapters because an explanation of layers was badly needed in the HOWTO, but never fixed it up. Since everyone is so eager to explain layers in forum threads, I'm hoping that someone will volunteer to fix up the article!

The HOWTO (and Plotscripting Tutorial) sample games are no longer included with the engine (because the HOWTO itself isn't since switching to wiki format), but you will find links to downloads as you read through the HOWTO. I would agree that the first 11 chapters of the HOWTO are still necessary reading. After the HOWTO, which left a lot of the engine uncovered, even as it was when it was written in the stone age, there are "extra chapters" listed on the HOWTO chapter index, but these are mostly very specific, and worse, not written by James ;) You could also try browsing through the FAQ for more information.

Some sample graphics are available at Free Sprites.

For blinking lights, see the Animating Maptiles HOWTO chapter.

Textboxes can optionally have "choice boxes", but these are limited to just two choices. If you want more than that, you'll have to use custom menus, which are much more complicated.

You can display larger graphics on-screen using the slice system. You can place any kind of sprite listed in the top-level graphics menu on the screen, but that's it. Slices are likely also the best thing to use for explosions. Fire: use animated map tiles. Rain is easiest to do with a overhead layer of animated map tiles. For something like clouds, use slices, since you can't scroll map layers independently across the screen. Animation of slices must be done manually (with scripts). It's a lot more labourious than it should be.

The party is limited to 4 heroes, with extra heroes placed in the reserve. Players can swap heroes in and out with the builtin 'Party' menu. If you want to limit it to 3 instead, you'd have to script your own replacement for the Party menu.

I think it's the ypsiliform+3 version....

I got it off the main OHRRPGCE site under the Download section.


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Here is what I'd like the opening of the game to accomplish: (Can it be done and how difficult would these things be?)

TITLE SCREEN


(OPENING)

Dr. Robert Nash enters Omono Labs Facility.

Player has control over character and can check the first wall computer where they read that it is locked.

After the first turn: {Character automatically walks down the rest of the corridor until reaching a second wall terminal next to a security door. Character accesses computer and enters credentials. Text Boxes inform the Player that this is Dr. Robert Nash, lead scientist over Project: Chimera Code. The Character enters the now open security door.}

Player can explore the next corridor and enter doors on the wall that lead to small office and lab rooms.
Several computer terminals can be accessed that reveal more background notes about Project: Chimera Code.
{Player must access at least three different computer terminals before Dr. Nash states that he must review Protocol 13 in the Master laboratory.}

After Accessing Three Terminals.

Player can continue to an elevator door that descends to B-2: Master Laboratory.
{Small map used to represent elevator interior as it descends}

Inside Master Laboratory.

Player enters the lab and must interact with an electronic device.
{Character starts to review/read over Protocol 13 for a few seconds before there is a loud ruckus inside the lab. Dr. Nash turns around and several NPCs enter. Four generic enemy NPCs and one Boss NPC.
A conversation between the Boss NPC and Dr. Nash begins.}

<Combat>
Dr. Nash cannot defeat this enemy.
<After>
The NPCs surround Dr. Nash. Text indicates that Dr. Nash is being taken hostage by the terrorist group.

{END OPENING}

(SCENE 1)

A city street is shown with a few buildings and cars parked along the shoulder.
Screen fades.
The interior of a building is shown that resembles an office.
A Character is present who is identified as Agent Adam Steele of Neon Steel International.
Adam reads a news paper headline that states Dr. Robert Nash had vanished.
An NPC enters the office and is identified as Sgt. Max Walker of the Federal Police Department.
Sgt. Walker gives Agent Steele clearance to investigate the possible abduction of Dr. Robert Nash.
Agent Steele accepts the job and Sgt. Walker leaves the office.

Player assumes control over Agent Steele who can explore the office and rest of the building.
He cannot leave the building until he encounters Agent Gale Clover, his partner who joins the party.
The Player can leave the building and enter the street where the cars are parked outside.
Agent Clover suggest they go to Omono Labs to investigate the scene.
Player can inspect a couple objects around the street to get items.
Player can interact with one of the cars to be asked if they would like to leave.
(If Player chooses to leave they will go to Omono Labs.)
{If Player does not leave they can continue to explore the city streets and visit shops and other locations.)

(Travel to Omono Labs)
Player Chooses to leave the streets.
{Cutscene plays showing car traveling down street)

Player arrives at Omono Labs. They must speak with a guard at the front gates to get clearance to enter. Other NPCs are standing outside the building including officers of the FPD and scientist.

(Inside Omono Labs)

Player enters the facility at a different area than the Opening. The Player must walk through several corridors and can explore different rooms for items. Some Lab animals have been released that pose a threat in some areas.

It seems to me that all of your opening scene is possible, and not too difficult to pull off. But it will require several plotscripts, and careful use of tags to distinguish when the player has performed all of the necessary actions before he is allowed to move on.

You should know that the default for losing a battle is a gameover, and to override this you need to write a special plotscript (it can be empty if needed) to put in place of the gameover when a battle is lost. You assign this plotscript in the "Special Plotscripts" menu in custom, which is in the "Edit General Game Data" menu.

You should also know that the default view of the screen is to focus the 'camera' on the player's character. The player must always have a character, but this character can be placed offscreen and the camera can be controlled independantly from there through plotscripting.

When I say that nearly anything is possible, I guess I meant "anything that you imagine for 2-D overhead RPGs". And even there, yeah certain things are still impossible, while others do need intensive scripting. The most fundamental limitation (besides resolution and audio control) might be the tile format. Pixel-based movement is possible, but pretty terrible to script in my opinion, if you plan to allow NPCs to move freely. If you're okay having your movement tile-based, then based on what you've explained about your game so far I'd say the OHR should be a good tool for you to use.

PS: The game sounds interesting so far! We hope to see a demo eventually!

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I am Srime

I knew most of this would require scripting. It's nice to hear that it can be done, though.



Had figured this as well. Actually, there is no real need for the battle to even occur but I figured it would give the Player more interaction during the opening and since I assumed there was a way to bypass the Game Over I would prefer to leave the battle in the game.



This is nice to know! I think I could make good use of camera control. Could you also use a Blank Walkabout slot in scenes where a character is not needed on screen?



I'm sure it would take a lot of pushing to reach the limits. I'm more concerned with how difficult it would be to do some of the things I'd like.

When you say there are limitations on audio control, what are you refering to? I will be able to set background music on individual maps and locations and use sound effects on maps without limitations, huh?

Using a blank walkabout is a possibility, but then he will still act as a wall. This is easy to override, but then the NPCs would be able to walk through each other as well, I think. Plus, if the player has more than one character in the group they will all need to be invisible. Most people just position the hero offscreen and then put the camera wherever they need it.

The audio limitations I'm talking about are more in depth. Setting background music and using sound effects are fine, but there is unfortunately no way within custom or plotscripting to affect their separate volumes; if the sound effects are too loud, you need to alter the sound files themselves. Also, this means there is no way to allow for sounds or music to be louder or softer (or faster or slower, or anything else) mid-game. So something like music that gets louder as the player gets closer to the end of the hallway, say, would be pretty much impossible. Or a heartbeat that gets quicker as the player moves forward. This one might be possible with some scripting tricks, but it probably wouldn't be fun.

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I am Srime

Ran into a bit of an issue.

I set the passability of some of my tiles in the tile editor (Set Default Tile Passability ) In the tile editor it has the flashing borders around the tiles however in-game the character is still passing through all the tiles.

it could be one of two things that i can think of: a script that disables walls you're forgetting about, or you set the tiles before you changed the default passability. you can change that by going into the map editor and "re-load default passability". the tiles in the maps aren't automatically changed when you change the default passability in the tileset editor.

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Hey, I just met you, and this is crazy... So here's some lunchmeat... Sandwich, maybe?

@MJ
Thanks, that got me back on track.


Now, can Hero sprites only be 32x40? But enemy sprites can be up to 80x80? I'm really gonna have to brush up on my pixel drawing!

Wow, the thread that brought TMC out of hiding and onto Slime Salad. What a historical moment. You should feel honored, Ninja. This moment was a long time coming and will never happen again.

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