Hmm, that makes sense... What if it gave you a guaranteed crit if you had 150% of the MP cost (and consumed the extra 50%), but had no effect otherwise?
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Twinconclusive wrote:
I think having it sap MP would be a little more tolerable.
And then it could sap your Health if you didn't have enough MP to feed it.
Mogri wrote:
It's 7.5% of your max health currently, though I'm up for other suggestions.
The problem with making it a percentage of damage is that many attacks that can crit don't deal any damage. 7.5% may be a bit high, but I'd rather it start out less useful than broken.
James Paige wrote:
Dang! the self-damage for Assassin's Dirk is HUGE!. 25% of every crit? Definitely not worth it. unless your name is Mogri and you have a billion HP
Thank Slime I still had time to withdraw from all the battles that I accepted with it equipped!
Thank Slime I still had time to withdraw from all the battles that I accepted with it equipped!
It's 7.5% of your max health currently, though I'm up for other suggestions.
The problem with making it a percentage of damage is that many attacks that can crit don't deal any damage. 7.5% may be a bit high, but I'd rather it start out less useful than broken.
I think having it sap MP would be a little more tolerable.
And then it could sap your Health if you didn't have enough MP to feed it.
Seconding this.
Perhaps there should also be a "darkside" attack that causes a gradual HP loss in exchange for increasing your damage output? This, along with 'Power Aura', 'Strength Focus', and 'Looking Sharp' with a Vengeance Sword - you'll end up doing ridiculous amounts of damage.
To friends long gone, and those I've yet to meet - thank you.
Ah, I see. I just assumed that the Assassin's dirk was taking 25% based on the last crit I did in fighting sludgehammer.
I was going to suggest that the self-damage should be X flat points + Y% od the damage dead, but more importantly that it should only deal that damage if you do a dirk-assisted crit, and not applied for a regular crit. And I was going to suggest adding some special flavor-text for a dirk-assisted crit that would spell out how much you are hurting yourself.
something like:
Although I do like the higher-mp-usage-equals-higher-damage idea a lot.
...but it seems different enough to warrant being a totally separate item.
I was going to suggest that the self-damage should be X flat points + Y% od the damage dead, but more importantly that it should only deal that damage if you do a dirk-assisted crit, and not applied for a regular crit. And I was going to suggest adding some special flavor-text for a dirk-assisted crit that would spell out how much you are hurting yourself.
something like:
Quote:
$attacker draws the assassin's dirk. Slime will spill tonight! $crit_text_for_this_attack ... but $attacker accidentally cuts slimeself with the dirk's razor edge, dealing $blowback damage to slimeself.
Although I do like the higher-mp-usage-equals-higher-damage idea a lot.
...but it seems different enough to warrant being a totally separate item.
Well, for now, we're going to try the "+50% MP = critical" idea and see how that works out.
Still got time to back out and re-equip it?
[Edit] Also, add Thief's Glove to your list of Mitosis buddies.
Mega Tact v1.1
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Still got time to back out and re-equip it?
[Edit] Also, add Thief's Glove to your list of Mitosis buddies.
Mega Tact v1.1
Super Penguin Chef
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Mogri wrote:
Well, for now, we're going to try the "+50% MP = critical" idea and see how that works out.
Still got time to back out and re-equip it? :D
Still got time to back out and re-equip it? :D
In two matches, yes, indeed I do! >:)
I was thinking about this:
Mogri wrote:
It's 7.5% of your max health currently, though I'm up for other suggestions.
It's 7.5% of your max health currently, though I'm up for other suggestions.
And although 7.5% sounds small, a slime with my attacks and preferred attack sets with double the chance to crit can expect to crit a little more than 50% of the time on average. So I could expect to suffer roughly rounds / 2 * 78 self-damage in every battle, which works out to a heck of a lot in a long battle.
James Paige wrote:
Although I do like the higher-mp-usage-equals-higher-damage idea a lot.
...but it seems different enough to warrant being a totally separate item.
...but it seems different enough to warrant being a totally separate item.
Soulsaber, from Final Fantasy VI has this effect, along with a number of other highly useful swords.
....Slimesaber?
To friends long gone, and those I've yet to meet - thank you.
There are a few items in FF6 that do that. Illumina does, for instance.
Mega Tact v1.1
Super Penguin Chef
Wizard Blocks
Mega Tact v1.1
Super Penguin Chef
Wizard Blocks
Whoa, guaranteed criticals sound like some scary business.
It'll be interesting to see how it plays out now.
Focus AGI has no critical effect with this dirk (I'll assume the other two don't either).
Shrink Ray also doesn't function when the critical activates.
♪♪♪ Du du duuuu ♪♪♪
It'll be interesting to see how it plays out now.
Focus AGI has no critical effect with this dirk (I'll assume the other two don't either).
Shrink Ray also doesn't function when the critical activates.
♪♪♪ Du du duuuu ♪♪♪
Twinconclusive wrote:
Focus AGI has no critical effect with this dirk (I'll assume the other two don't either).
Shrink Ray also doesn't function when the critical activates.
Shrink Ray also doesn't function when the critical activates.
Oh craps, I was bypassing the check to see whether the attack SHOULD be able to crit. Fixed now, sorry about that.
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Ohmy
I actually tried the same process with the good Judge, but he seems pretty impervious.
♪♪♪ Du du duuuu ♪♪♪
I actually tried the same process with the good Judge, but he seems pretty impervious.
♪♪♪ Du du duuuu ♪♪♪
Yeah, I saw your Judge attempt. Nice strategy, but he's just barely too agile for you.
!
The attack did 4 damage? I forgot about the damage variance! That means that on a lucky crit, you could still kill the Judge that way.
For the curious, here is the exact variance formula:
So you're dealing probably 4.5 damage base (this is unintentional), which goes as low as 3.645 with variance.
Actually, it occurs to me that the really broken Coup de Grāce is the one with a Slimesword (+10 to all attacks). I am now going to disable this, but suffice it to say that you guys could have OHKO'd pretty much anything that way.
The new behavior is that you can shake off the attack before the damage is modified (so before variance and multipliers and bonuses) as well as after. (edit) This change won't be noticeable in the majority of cases.
Mega Tact v1.1
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!
The attack did 4 damage? I forgot about the damage variance! That means that on a lucky crit, you could still kill the Judge that way.
For the curious, here is the exact variance formula:
Code:
$damage *= rand(81, 123) / 100; // avg = 100.12%
So you're dealing probably 4.5 damage base (this is unintentional), which goes as low as 3.645 with variance.
Actually, it occurs to me that the really broken Coup de Grāce is the one with a Slimesword (+10 to all attacks). I am now going to disable this, but suffice it to say that you guys could have OHKO'd pretty much anything that way.
The new behavior is that you can shake off the attack before the damage is modified (so before variance and multipliers and bonuses) as well as after. (edit) This change won't be noticeable in the majority of cases.
Mega Tact v1.1
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Quote:
Actually, it occurs to me that the really broken Coup de Grāce is the one with a Slimesword (+10 to all attacks). I am now going to disable this, but suffice it to say that you guys could have OHKO'd pretty much anything that way.
Oh wow! I hadn't even realized that the death effect was the result of the actual damage until you brought it up.
Quote:
The new behavior is that you can shake off the attack before the damage is modified (so before variance and multipliers and bonuses) as well as after. (edit) This change won't be noticeable in the majority of cases.
Why are the variances, multipliers, and bonuses needed at all if you can shrug the attack off before they're applied?
♪♪♪ Du du duuuu ♪♪♪
Quote:
Why are the variances, multipliers, and bonuses needed at all if you can shrug the attack off before they're applied?
I'm not sure I understand your question. Variance, multipliers, and bonuses modify the amount of damage done.
Here's an example of what has changed:
Before: You're holding a Slimesword. You fumble and deal only 5 damage to a target with 80 Agi, but the Slimesword boosts the damage to 15 and the attack goes through.
Now: You're holding a Slimesword. You fumble and deal only 5 damage to a target with 80 Agi. The attack fails.
Like I said, this is a very marginal edge case. You rarely deal so little damage with a normal attack. The one case where it really does make a difference is Coup de Grāce, and for Coup de Grāce you should be aware that the damage isn't truncated when it does the check. So if you'd deal 3.6 damage to a target with 35 Agi, the attack can succeed.
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Mogri wrote:
That means that on a lucky crit, you could still kill the Judge that way.
Is tht a crit that's luckier than others? Because that fail he had was a crit. Honestly, Twin, just seeing some of your recent attempts, Damage Chain For Real in particular, I think you'd have a pretty good chance if your Agi was higher.
You know, high enough that you'd go first if he was Paralyzed, which puts his Agi at what, 101?
EDIT: 102, I was close. So if your Agi was 103 or above and you started off with a successful Super Shock, I daresay you might have him.



